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  • Sep 20, 2014
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My Take
PUBLISHED : Wednesday, 12 June, 2013, 12:00am
UPDATED : Wednesday, 12 June, 2013, 4:58am

Jack So is right about Occupy Central

Oh boy, the United Front must not be working properly. A day after Chief Executive Leung Chun-ying talked tough about not tolerating the Occupy Central movement, a key establishment figure said the protest movement, even if it went ahead, would be no big deal.

The US had Occupy Wall Street, said Jack So Chak-kwong, chairman of the Trade Development Council, so Hong Kong will have Occupy Central. Well, this is actually going to be Occupy Central 2.0, which aims to pressure the government to introduce universal suffrage, in contrast with Occupy Central 1.0, which was just vaguely anti-capitalist.

"The Occupy Central movement would be just another form of expression of views if it proceeds peacefully," So said in New York. Vigorous debate on social issues is proof of the city's respect for freedom of expression, one of the core values that make it attractive as an investment destination for foreigners.

There is nothing to fear, So told the Post.

So's message contrasts sharply with that of Leung, who warned the movement there was "no possibility" it could be lawful or peaceful and that it would not be tolerated by the government or the courts. Speaking in unison, Leung's supporter and New World Development boss Henry Cheng Kar-shun said the plan would be illegal no matter what loopholes it exploited and would disturb the city's economic order.

The Heung Yee Kuk, which usually represents rural interests and is geographically far away from Central, took out full-page advertisements in pro-Beijing newspapers calling for the safeguarding of Hong Kong's social harmony and stability.

Why the discrepancy in the establishment's messages about Occupy Central? My guess is that Leung, Cheng and the kuk had Beijing as the intended target audience, while So was trying to sound more conciliatory as a trade representative.

As questionable as the Occupy movement and its tactics are, sounding dire and serious warnings against it will only help it attract public attention and make it appear more serious than it actually is. So has hit the right approach to dealing with it, which is to treat it like all other protests that are nothing special.

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whymak
Jve:
Do you know anything about modeling in science and economics? Models start with ideal cases. Yes, in theoretical physics, we start by assuming spherical horses.
Let me assume that you are intelligent enough for high school physics. As reader pslhk likes to say, English speaking people, of which you qualify, can't think. Now listen carefully.
Niels Bohr modeled the hydrogen atom with the electron orbiting around a positively charged nucleus. He hypothesized that angular momentum must be a discreet quantity. Voila! It explained the observed spectral lines.
The picture or model violated existing physical laws since electrons in circular orbit must radiate and lose energy. Eventually quantum theory explains everything.
Networks, including neural, transcription, microeconomics networks, etc. all start with potential connections as the basic assumption. Physical principles needed to sustain system equilibrium reduce the number of connections. But the exponential rule for number of connections remains correct.
How do I explain physics if you don't understand simple algebra? Moreover, in Holland's column, your comment displays an ignorance of Solow's neoclassical theory and growth accounting. I can go on and on but won't.
Hand-waving is easy. Knowledge and thinking are hard. Conversation can be fun. Sarah Palin almost made vice president. Like you, she can talk a mile a minute. Does she make sense?
Now reader "pslhk" can now gloat over this one.
impala
No, models do not start with ideal cases. Especially not in economics. Models start with assumptions. Assumptions define the limitations of the forecasting ability of the model and its degree of applicability to reality. The resulting simplification is understood to be an approximation of the real world, not an ideal case.

Whymak's assumption that everybody in China knows everybody else in China by a direct link is lunatic. Any model (or even a theory) operating with that assumption will produce nothing but gibberish, no matter how many Nobel prize or Field Medal winners he quotes, or no matter how often he calls his opponents names. It is that simple.

And regardless of all that, I can only point out I am still waiting for reader whymak's demonstration of the existence of an inverse correlation between population and freedom. Even just a faintly sloping regression would do, thank you. Why would we even create a 'model' or a theory if there is no phenomenon to explain in the first place?

Still waiting....

In short, reader whymak is just trolling. His only distinction is that he dresses it up with a sauce of secondary school textbook terminology and some -supposedly impressing- names dropping.

One thing I have learnt over the years, is that those who feel a constant need to show off their intelligence and attempt to put others down with it, are in fact the dumbest people around. Reader whymak fits that category very well. An ideal case I would almost say.
johnyuan
I once had an odd job at the library of Physics Department during my undergrad studies. Being the Assistant to the Assistant Liberian my duty included stooping down to remove used chewing gums that stuck under the reading desks and climbing up and down stacking books. Mr. Dodson, the Chief Liberian told me the story how once an empire was lost because of failure of king’s horse in a war when his horse had lost its horseshoe. I am sure if I ever want my part-time back; Mr. Dodson would welcome me because I left the Library just the way when I first arrived – clean and orderly. What too impressed me was the occasional music surfing from across the hallway where a grand piano in a lounge there being pounded upon. All I must say it is a scientifically ordered and civil experience. It becomes part of my life and no one can and should take away from me.
whymak
Johnyuan:
You forget that when Koch ran for the first term, he used Bess Meyerson as cover for his gayness. After he left office for good, my wife and I once sat across from him a few tables away in a restaurant at the Village. Yep, he was now quite open with a partner in public.
No one shows more tolerance than spectators watching total naked weirdoes in San Francisco Gay Parade. Yet no city could beat the Parisians in taking for granted the widest political spectrum. Unfortunately, permissiveness for strikes and demonstrations inconveniences everyone and causes economic loss to the public. I experienced cancellations at both Opera Bastille and Garnier during my sojourns at the City of Lights. Unlike Hong Kong, the French are not afraid to enforce the law. I saw lawyers in their black gowns arrested and packed into wagons during their salary negotiations with the government.
Should we be tolerant to those given total speech freedom -- perhaps even to the point of free to libel -- and still hold the public hostage to their intransigent puerile demands at the drop of a hat?
I like tolerant cities -- don't know if HK qualifies -- because people aren't provincial. But tolerance must not be extended to hateful people because their sole mission is to destroy.
Of course, this leads to the next question. How can you tell who is hateful?
johnyuan
What I still remember about Koch includes his frequent query into public asking, “How am I doing?” Such confidence indeed.
Yes, Garnier’s Opera House is festive and emotionally joyful to look at. Unfortunately those afterthought gates installed between columns deprived me the freedom to wander in during my visit. Its Bastille counter part isn’t as great. The design is more a knockoff of Richard Meier’s rational style which the design competition jury might have mistaken and ruled. Mitterrand should have left Bastille alone for its significance as a birthplace of the French Revolution.
Here I saved for decades from NYTimes reporting on samples of philosophical questions asked of French students in their high school graduating exam:
1. Does knowledge inhibit the imagination?
2. Is a coherent thought necessarily true?
3. Can a work of art be considered immoral?
4. Is reality always realistic?
5. Can self-knowledge be sincere?
6. How do you know that a problem is philosophical?
7. Is a philosophical necessarily a man of his times?
8. Is reason a guarantee against deception?
johnyuan
The intellectualism of the Parisian and the French may explain Paris as a city why saved itself from destruction even from Hitler. New York City certainly has greatly benefited from the gift of the Liberty Statue from the Parisians gracing its harbor so daily reminding New Yorkers of liberty and tolerance – the fountain of civility.
If one can’t hate one is not human. But make sure we do it correctly. Crime that committed with hate is considered as hate crime in the US. At least ruling by the law may force us to behave a bit better especially in the public.
whymak
Jve:
Eat your heart out, my wife and I saw the Book of Mormon at Broadway just a week before Jack So arrived in New York City. Okay, I won't bring up your mathematics illiteracy this time around.
Anyway, if this musical is ever made into a movie, you and your brainwashed Democracy faithful should see it. Mormon elders are a whole like your ilk.
With his vocabulary maxed out at just a few 4-letter words, reader wwwong888 王八蛋 definitely should see it. The hilariously funny profanities of this musical will not only augment his shamefully exiguous vernacular, but also teach him how to deliver vulgarity to effect.
Isn't it interesting that one could guess a person by his pseudonym? For someone using 王八蛋 as a penname, it's quite likely his wife or girlfriend might be someone like 潘金蓮 in 水滸傳 .
I must admit that I take great pride in putting down hate-China folks with Chinese classics.
I gather reader johnyuan had spent sometime in NYC too. Since he is a gentlemanly good egg, I will exchange with him nothing but pleasantries.
impala
Are you still referring to the lunatic mathematics in which you assumed that every person in China knows every other person in China? Oh and, and that reminds me, I am still waiting for your empirical demonstration of the correlation (I am putting the bar low, not even asking for causation) between a bigger population and less freedom.

Still waiting...

Stil waitting...

But back to topic - why whymak, may I ask, do you falsely claim that "[Zuccotti Park] is not anywhere near the financial institutions clustered around Wall Street"?

Also, I would love to hear your oh-so-intelligent opinion about this. If the Occupy Central protestors only occupy places like Statue Square, Chater Garden, perhaps the pedestrian area near the City Hall, and (so) we deal with them the same way as Mr Bloomberg did in New York, would that be ok? Maybe then can do that, and throw in a protest march on Sunday afternoon with your permission? Or is the bottom line you'd rather not see any protest in Hong Kong that disturbs the harmony? Enlighten us please.
whymak
Jve:
If you want to babble in economics in Holland's column, read my critique in:
****www.scmp.com/comment/debates/article/1232093/jake-van-der-kamp-versus-tom-holland-who-right-hong-kong-consumer
impala
But back to topic - why whymak, may I ask, do you falsely claim that "[Zuccotti Park] is not anywhere near the financial institutions clustered around Wall Street"?

Also, I would love to hear your oh-so-intelligent opinion about this. If the Occupy Central protestors only occupy places like Statue Square, Chater Garden, perhaps the pedestrian area near the City Hall, and (so) we deal with them the same way as Mr Bloomberg did in New York, would that be ok? Maybe then can do that, and throw in a protest march on Sunday afternoon with your permission? Or is the bottom line you'd rather not see any protest in Hong Kong that disturbs the harmony? Enlighten us please.

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